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 Issue with MSR Lightning Ascents 
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Leg Burner
Leg Burner

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:29 am
Posts: 87
Location: Woodstock VT
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 Issue with MSR Lightning Ascents
After only 100 miles or so of reasonably hard use, one of the rails has developed a pretty significant ding, adjacent to the instep.

Anybody else experienced this? I'm wondering if its a design or manufacturing flaw, or just something I should ignore

Other than this, I love them. Guess I'll try to return them at EMS and see what they have to say...

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Sat Mar 08, 2014 1:29 pm
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Mountain Maestro
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Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:22 pm
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If a "ding" is the worst thing to happen to them you should probably consider yourself lucky.

http://www.vftt.org/forums/showthread.p ... ents-R-I-P

My friend had a pair with buth pulled rivets and the cracked crampon just last year so the problems have not been fixed.


Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:55 pm
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Sovereign Woodsman
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Joined: Wed Sep 07, 2011 8:10 pm
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Location: Natick, MA
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What do you mean by a ding? Frame dented in? Or something else? My pair has been beat up pretty well the last 3 winters, probably over 500 miles on them, and aside from the side frame crampons getting a bit worn down, they still keep on ticking.

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Sun Mar 09, 2014 9:39 am
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Leg Burner
Leg Burner

Joined: Sun Nov 27, 2011 7:29 am
Posts: 87
Location: Woodstock VT
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 Dented Lightning Ascents
Yeah, the rail is dented inwards about1/4", adjacent to the instep, enough so the deck is affected and flops around a little. No idea how it happened and I wouldn't worry about it except the deck's affected and I've heard about others having "issues" with them..

Went to EMS today and the young girl there first accused me of abusing the and being too big (6'4", 220#); then said EMS uses these for rental because they're so durable and she's never seen anything like this. Said she'd be glad to swap them out for a new pair, except they're out so stock for the season; and recommended that I contact MSR.

Oh yeah, she said I should also stay off "the forums" because "those people" spend all their time on-line complaining and hardly ever actually get outdoors.

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Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:50 pm
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Hiking Forums Are My Crack
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Joined: Wed Apr 14, 2010 8:37 pm
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Location: Exeter, NH
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Haha! Yes. Stop talking to other people who love talking hiking and use the same gear. Just take the word of the girl behing the counter, because I'm sure she uses her mens lightening ascents often and can offer up first hand info on the subject. :roll: And I was always under the impression that the weight reccomendation was for their floatation ability (which doesn't really matter on hard packed trails) and not the maximum load limit where they'd crumple and crush under stress.

It really sounds like normal wear and tear. It just happens. Dings dents scratches tears etc etc are not design flaws. Rivets popping out, decks separating, bindings breaking. Those are design flaws. That said if either the store or the company are willing to exchange them you may as well take them up on it.


Sun Mar 09, 2014 1:11 pm
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Sovereign Woodsman
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FWIW, the issues that most folks have had with the Lightnings was the foot crampon plate shearing. I noticed last year that this crampon was redesigned, I don't know if it helped, hurt, or did nothing to alleviate the problem. I do know of a few incidents involving the frames getting mangled, but that was from a lot of rock-hopping over big gaps, etc.

Quote:
Oh yeah, she said I should also stay off "the forums" because "those people" spend all their time on-line complaining and hardly ever actually get outdoors.

Well that is actually true of some places (generally not forums though, more the reviews pages where there are definitely a lot of questionable folks...), obviously not here, VFTT, or ADKHP.

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Mon Mar 10, 2014 9:12 am
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Mountain Maestro
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Joined: Tue Feb 02, 2010 11:22 pm
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Oh yeah, Cascade Designs is great for returns. When my Denali Ascents broke I sent them back along with the tails and had a brand new pair of Evo Ascents and tails within a week. I've wondered what they would have done if I had had both sets of tails for the Denalis(they offered 4" and 8" tails, the Evo only has 6").

If I ever need a high price item with limited utility I'll try and get it from Backcountry.com because their policy means all your gear is very liquid.


Tue Mar 11, 2014 1:04 am
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I Spend All My Time on This Forum
I Spend All My Time on This Forum

Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:04 pm
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Location: Newmarket, NH
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I hear a lot of stories from people who say how great customer service is when you have a problem with MSRs. That's good to know. However, you could also go with Tubbs and then you may never have to find out whether or not their customer service department is good. 8)

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Tue Mar 11, 2014 8:57 am
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Sovereign Woodsman
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BobC wrote:
I hear a lot of stories from people who say how great customer service is when you have a problem with MSRs. That's good to know. However, you could also go with Tubbs and then you may never have to find out whether or not their customer service department is good. 8)


Or, like me, you could find that it is good but incredibly slow, as in goodbye snowshoes for half a season.
I think it was about 5 years ago, and maybe they've improved, but when mine fell apart , they were gone for a long time. They did get fixed, though....
But they were/are nowhere near as rugged as my MSRs.
Which, sadly, have a broken support. Guess I'll find out how MSR CS stacks up :)

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Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:01 am
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scooter wrote:
BobC wrote:
I hear a lot of stories from people who say how great customer service is when you have a problem with MSRs. That's good to know. However, you could also go with Tubbs and then you may never have to find out whether or not their customer service department is good. 8)


Or, like me, you could find that it is good but incredibly slow, as in goodbye snowshoes for half a season.
I think it was about 5 years ago, and maybe they've improved, but when mine fell apart , they were gone for a long time. They did get fixed, though....
But they were/are nowhere near as rugged as my MSRs.
Which, sadly, have a broken support. Guess I'll find out how MSR CS stacks up :)


Which model did you have and what went wrong Scooter? I've heard of very few complaints on the flex Alps. I love mine. They might be a couple inches longer and a couple ounces heavier but the traction, crampon and binding seem superior to the MSRs that I've seen. Build quality seems superior too based on how many reports of failures I see and hear about with MSRs. But maybe I've just missed the ones on the Tubbs.


Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:23 am
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Sovereign Woodsman
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I dont remember the model, but they were the kind with aluminum tubes that fit into each other, with plastic sheet webbing. The webbing was held on by rivets. When the webbing pulled out from the rivets there wasnt enough tension to hold the tubes together.

I believe the Tubbs design has changed, but not before I bought the MSRs .
After the wait time to get the Tubbs fixed I gave up on Tubbs.

I occasionally think about going back to them because of the bindings on my wife's pair , but I dunno. Maybe next year. Too late now, everybody's out of stock ... makes the (in)decision easy :)

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Tue Mar 11, 2014 9:30 am
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I Spend All My Time on This Forum
I Spend All My Time on This Forum

Joined: Wed Feb 14, 2007 2:04 pm
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Location: Newmarket, NH
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Your Tubbs sound like my old Tubbs - the Venture model. I did have a problem but it wasn't a design flaw, I caught one of them on a branch and it pulled one of the straps right out around the rivet. I brought them back to EMS and they sent them to Tubbs, and I got them back in about 3 weeks. That was about 6 years ago though. I have the Flex Alps now which are a totally different design, of course.

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Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:13 am
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I've had a pair of Ventures for about 8 years now. I still use them when I need extra flotation or on rocky trails with thin cover that I don't want to bang the flex alps up on, but the FA is my go to mountaineering shoe now. The ventures are still going strong though. Tubbs also has the more aggressive wilderness and mountaineer series in the same type of design but unless you do a lot of off trail travel and need floatation they seem to be over sized and overkill for packed out trail travel these days.


Tue Mar 11, 2014 10:29 am
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Mountain Maestro
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Good day,

I am one of the few that has had a "failure" with the Tubbs Flex Alps. It was about 3 Winters ago- on the infamous Twins/Galehead blizzard deathmarch hike with Joe/Brian/Salty....
What failed was the head of one of the binding rivots, wore off. This particular rivot is used to mount the outside yellow buckle for the rear strap, to the plastic binding. The head of the rivot got worn off from my boot rubbing up against it.
OGRob was kind enough to give me a tie-wrap, which I used to secure the rear strap to the plastic binding. Since then, I keep a few tie-wraps handy in my camera bag on my shoulder strap.
The tie-wrap then remained on the snowshoe for 3 years, until I lent them to someone with smaller feet, who cut the tie-wrap and installed a new one in a different hole.

Failed Rivot
Image

Fixed in a Jiffy
Image

I did call Tubbs on this issue, and they said I would have to send them in....couldn't tell me if they would be covered......so I didn't bother.


Tie-wraps,
don't leave home without them

Petch

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Mon Mar 17, 2014 11:54 am
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I also carry a little bag of zip ties ever since the plastic webbing on a friends snowshoe came unriveted and we had no way to fix it. Made for some nice post holing on the Gale River Trail.

On the Flex alps I feel like I could crank the front bindings down tight enough to get by in a pinch without the back strap, but better safe than sorry.


Mon Mar 17, 2014 12:59 pm
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