Click for Mount Washington, New Hampshire Forecast

Mt. Washington Temp.
Click pic for forecast.

...More Topics...

 

 

Get Firefox!

Backcountry ski and snowboard gear, camping

Donate towards my web hosting bill!

Made with CSS

Validated by W3C

       
View unanswered posts | View active topics It is currently Sat Dec 05, 2020 12:55 pm



This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
 Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016 
Author Message
Flatfoot
Flatfoot

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:19 am
Posts: 13
 Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
I always plan more than I can do and usually fail at ¾. This time my plan was to do about 30 4000’ in the whites, but had to stop much earlier. My girlfriend would help me with the Whites traverses and this would make the job much easier instead of hitch hiking.

Here is my plan for the whites, based on Tim Seaver's 2003 record, with various alternatives. The blue numbers are the trailhead I was going to do in order and green points safe day hikes for my girlfriend. The ordering is to minimize car travel and allow for both of us to have fun. She did enjoy the Tom/Field loop (5) while I was hiking the presidential traverse (3-4).

Image

Wildcat, Carters, Moriah traverse - 0h00 - 2016/02/06

I left at midnight for the Carter-Moriah traverse (1-2). This one was pretty nice. I went up the Lone Cat ski route, and even had some whiteout conditions under the snow machines. The snowshoes stayed on my pack and used only the hillsounds. There were some sections with 2 feet snow, but these were wind deposited. Route finding was very easy and I could see the city lights of Gorham approaching all along the hike. I catched a glimpse of the sunrise on Moriah, it was a gorgeous band of red to blue. I crossed two hikers going to Moriah, they must have left pretty early. At lower elevation, I wanted to reduce foot fatigue and removed my hillsounds. I slipped twice hurting myself on the second time and put them back on.

I ate one coffee crisp bar and drank 500ml of water which was completely frozen at the end.

Image
Sort of gives an idea, sunrise on Moriah summit

18 miles, 7h37, 8494 feet gain, avg HR 139
https://www.strava.com/activities/487087318

Presidential Traverse + Jackson - 9h07 - 2016/02/06

I started this one a bit late, but it was nice regaining a bit of energy. Ate some McDonalds breakfast and headed to the Appalachia trailhead. I’ve done this traverse many times before, twice in winter, but never solo. In this direction, I would have the wind in my face, but as long as I would be comfortable with the Maddison wind and I could be past Washington in daylight, it should be fine. I still was pretty anxious about it and conditions turned out to be the worst I had ever experienced. Wind was at least gale strength most of the time and no snow pack over all the rocks made it difficult mixed conditions.

The summit of Madison always has violent winds, but after it, it’s calm. Although this time, I went up the Watson Path and it was the first time I climbed this face and understood it had all the winds! It was cold and hard pushing against it, but at the same time it gave me confidence about going to Washington. Winds were constant over 45 mph with some 60 gusts and visibility was good. I met with a group of 6 relaxing at Madison hut. They told me to never climb from Watson in winter and gave me much needed water.

Image

Adam and Jefferson went well although wind was hitting at more places than usual. I was expecting about 60 mph winds on Washington's summit and 200 feet of visibility, enough to see the cairns. But I wasn'’t expecting this to start at Washington’'s base. Going up was quite an experience. Everything was moving in fast motion: clouds, snow, visibility… Sometimes I couldn't see the next cairns and I got lost going up. At the summit, I hid behind the hut and made sure to know where to go back. Going to Isolation was out of the question at this point, I wouldn't do it in these conditions and it was almost dark. I put on my big down jacket over everything and headed back down. I wasn't sure where to go and ended up losing the cairns again. I looked at my GPS and seemed close, but still couldn't find the cairns and wasn't sure anymore where to go. This may have lasted five minutes, but my hands froze, I panicked a bit, but eventually found the cairns and ran down to less wind exposure. It took time before I could see again and darkness was setting in.

Image
Picture doesn't show the 60mph winds

Image
This one does

After this point, everything else was slow and it took two hours to regain my heat and remove the big down jacket. I’m not sure if this happened before or after Washington, but throughout the traverse, the surface was all ice or rock. This ended up wearing away my hillsounds and they weren’t grabbing as much to ice and I slid and hit the side of my foot on rock. I thought I had sprained my ankle, but luckily only damaged the bone and tissue of my 5th metatarsal. The pain was sharp, but I continued moving and changed my gait to use my big toe.

Image
Hiding from the wind on Washington summit

I couldn't wait to get passed Eisenhower, because after it, I'd be under treeline. Then zombie walked to Pierce, Jackson and back to the car. 10 minutes later, I couldn't walk anymore and decided to abort the weekend and go back to Montreal. 24 hours later I still can't walk and will know if it's broken once inflammation resorbs. I'm surprised I was able to walk 11 miles and descend steep 4000 feet with this injury. Last time I was on Washington, I strained my quad descending and limped the same distance, but skipped Pierce and Jackson.

I ate one coffee crisp bar, one frozen banana and 6 frozen dates. Drank 750ml water. I dragged the snowshoes for Isolation, but never used them.

21.6 miles, 11h57, 11 293 feet gain, avg HR 123
https://www.strava.com/activities/487803336

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g3CN-CE4dOE
Video of the winds, most of them taken covered from exposure:

Conclusion

Today I saw that it's possible to be comfortable in 60mph winds with no visibility or darkness. This could happen on Baxter or the Pemiloop, but I need:
-practice with a reliable GPS (batteries need to last) for whiteout conditions
-wear bigger gloves and be able to use the GPS without removing them
-find a better facemask solution (I used two thin buffs and no goggles, because they fog up)
-better study the area before going there and find many escapes
-keep calm

I'm going to see if my foot heals, if not I won't be able to continue the W115 and with the little I did this weekend it will be very hard to finish.

*I've posted this on adkhighpeaks, but since this is related to new hamshire, I'm posting my report here too. Hope you found it interesting.


Sun Feb 07, 2016 9:47 pm
Profile
Sovereign Woodsman
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:21 am
Posts: 1818
Location: Lynn MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
What a bummer about the foot man. I'm shocked you were able to complete the traverse with an injury like that. How difficult was it to stay vertical with 60mph winds?


Mon Feb 08, 2016 12:25 pm
Profile
Flatfoot
Flatfoot

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:19 am
Posts: 13
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
Yeah, I really hope it's not broken, it's not swollen anymore, but any walking is painful and will inflame it. It was hardest to stay vertical climbing Madison and balancing on the rocks going up. I'd lean on the wind, but sometimes it would stop and I would lose balance. You can also do some Mario Bros moves, like jump one direction and change direction mid air :) But the winds might be the reason why I hurt my foot, I can't recall when it happened.

Looking at the forecast history, winds must have been constant 45-50mph on Washington with 60 gusts so not that bad for staying vertical, visibility and snow in the face was my main concern as well as getting swept from a gust since most of the climb was an ice slide, so I would plant my spikes each step climbing and have the ice axe ready for self arrest.


Mon Feb 08, 2016 1:15 pm
Profile
Sovereign Woodsman
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:21 am
Posts: 1818
Location: Lynn MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
Seems kinda fun with the wind. The fastest I've ever ran is with a tail wind at the beach during a noreaster. I remember laughing at how easy it was to casually gallop faster than I could normally sprint.


Mon Feb 08, 2016 1:23 pm
Profile
Sovereign Woodsman

Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2012 2:40 pm
Posts: 1664
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
WOW!!!!! I would have been scared s-less! I'm scared s-less just reading this story! Hope you feel better.


Mon Feb 08, 2016 10:56 pm
Profile
Mountaineer
Mountaineer

Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 115
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
So what was your overall goal when you set out? How fast did you expect to finish 30 peaks?

You might be setting your goals a little too ambitiously if you "usually fail".

If I'm doing the math right, you did almost 40 miles in less than 20 hours. That's incredible given the conditions and the terrain. It's pretty awesome even in fair conditions. So I apologize if I'm a bit mystified by your freakish abilities, but I'm really curious now.

How tall are you?
Are your legs unusually long?
Would you say you have an "above average" metabolism?
How heavy was your pack?
How old are you?
Would you say that you were 'running' during any stretches of these hikes?

And why in such a hurry to get back to Montreal? If I'm reading this right, you only got done with about 1/3 of your planned hiking. There are plenty of hotels, restaurants, and indoor water parks in the area. Help us out man. The tourism revenue is what keeps the trails open!


Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:09 pm
Profile
Master Mountaineer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:04 am
Posts: 913
Location: Worcester, MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
rich99 wrote:
-wear bigger gloves and be able to use the GPS without removing them
-find a better facemask solution (I used two thin buffs and no goggles, because they fog up)


Thanks for these two points - these are things I find difficult.
First, any thoughts from anyone on solving the Dexterity vs Insulation dichotomy?
Second, are there any options for preventing fogging?

I use Julbo Glacier Glasses. They're usually fine, but once the sweat and heat kick in, they almost invariable fog up. Is there a wax or film you can put on your goggles/mask to prevent fogging?

Thanks.

_________________
Nothin' on the top but a bucket and a mop,
and an illustrated book about birds.
You see alot up there, but don't be scared:
Who needs actions when you got words?


Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:37 pm
Profile
Sovereign Woodsman
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:21 am
Posts: 1818
Location: Lynn MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
iagreewithjamie wrote:
rich99 wrote:
-wear bigger gloves and be able to use the GPS without removing them
-find a better facemask solution (I used two thin buffs and no goggles, because they fog up)


Thanks for these two points - these are things I find difficult.
First, any thoughts from anyone on solving the Dexterity vs Insulation dichotomy?
Second, are there any options for preventing fogging?

I use Julbo Glacier Glasses. They're usually fine, but once the sweat and heat kick in, they almost invariable fog up. Is there a wax or film you can put on your goggles/mask to prevent fogging?

Thanks.


I've had good luck wearing light gloves under my nice and big ones. That way you can slide off the larger glove and regain some dexterity for short moments that need it.

To prevent fogging some people have recommended stuff called "cat crap" I've seen it in small containers at EMS. I've never used it however.


Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:45 pm
Profile
Mountaineer
Mountaineer

Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 115
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
iagreewithjamie wrote:
First, any thoughts from anyone on solving the Dexterity vs Insulation dichotomy?


Stylus

iagreewithjamie wrote:
Second, are there any options for preventing fogging?


Spit


Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:53 pm
Profile
Master Mountaineer
User avatar

Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2013 10:04 am
Posts: 913
Location: Worcester, MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
BrianL wrote:
iagreewithjamie wrote:
First, any thoughts from anyone on solving the Dexterity vs Insulation dichotomy?


Stylus

OK... that's pretty smart.

BrianL wrote:
iagreewithjamie wrote:
Second, are there any options for preventing fogging?


Spit


Wouldn't that create an ice problem?

_________________
Nothin' on the top but a bucket and a mop,
and an illustrated book about birds.
You see alot up there, but don't be scared:
Who needs actions when you got words?


Tue Feb 09, 2016 3:59 pm
Profile
Sovereign Woodsman
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2012 9:21 am
Posts: 1818
Location: Lynn MA
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
You can use your nose in a pinch for a touch screen.


Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:02 pm
Profile
Mountaineer
Mountaineer

Joined: Fri Nov 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 115
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
iagreewithjamie wrote:
Wouldn't that create an ice problem?


Probably. I was actually just guessing with that one. I know divers do it.

I actually don't have fogging problems with my goggles. I bought them at a ski shop I don't know how many years ago. It does look like they have some vents around the edges though, so maybe that's what's keeping me from having trouble.

As a complete guess, I would say you could try some of this stuff

http://www.amazon.com/Klasse-High-Gloss-Sealant-Glaze/dp/B009T9O99G

If it doesn't work out, you can still use it to wax your car. Most folks don't realize that modern clear coats have made traditional carnauba waxes almost totally obsolete. You'll LOVE the *pop* you get with this stuff, and it lasts much much longer than a normal wax job. It's also useful for about a million things around the house. From countertops to bathtubs, you can put that sh1t on everything. If you have a pet who likes to walk on top of your washing machine, lay down a coat of this stuff, and prepare for hilariousness.


Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:10 pm
Profile
Flatfoot
Flatfoot

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:19 am
Posts: 13
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
Hi Brian, I've read your posts and found them funny. I'll answer, because others might find this interesting and see it’s accessible to most with dedication and desire to hike this way. It's just a different style and most would never do this. I do these plans and hike this way in part because it brings me closer to the adventures of mountaineering heroes. This day seems like a lot, but it’s much easier than 3 days in the Tour de France or the various 100 miles endurance races people like to do.

The goal now is to try to finish a single season winter 115, but I don't have much free time. I’ve heard no one has done it before, but I’d be surprised if this were true. I find it should be easy for someone with time and average fitness. I can only hike on weekends and 4 of them were taken. I also wasn't planning to do this until after the 3rd week of winter, so the start wasn't optimal. It's fun and challenging and I always liked to do big loops so already had a good start.

I expected to finish the 30 peaks the way they are outlined in the plan. Go from point 1 to 12. I'm usually solo, but my girlfriend helping me allowed to plan more. The crux was the presidentials and the other hikes I could have gone very lightweight and much faster. Yes I usually fail, but that's how I plan, so this way I can do the maximum possible and reach my limits. If I finished what I was set to do, then I'd still have unused energy and time :) My first post here, I almost got my original plan.

Those aren't freakish abilities, I'm an above average ultra runner, but far from elite. I can't touch the records (FKT) of the pemiloop or presi traverse.

I'm 33, 6' and 160lbs and it's a big disadvantage for ultra endurance. Too tall and heavy. My genetics (VO2max) for endurance events are average, my 5k PB is only 20 minutes after 3 years of training. I don't run much anymore because of tears in my adductors since 4 years ago so I started hiking mountains, but I train all year long for this. I'm also a very good technical runner and can run fast any rugged terrain of the whites, so it helps avoid destroying the legs in long hikes even when I go slow.

The key thing I guess is logistics. I travel safe, but very light. My pack was about 15 pounds including food and water I find this is heavy. I carried snowshoes and enough to bivy. That’s a bit extreme, but I was scared of the traverse and Washington where wind have pushed people of the mountain. I don’t have double clothes, but learned to never wet what I wear. I usually run a bit in all my hikes, but almost none in this one, because I was going long. To go long, you need to go slow and steady and never stop. This is how people do the appalachian traverse under 60 days hiking 60 miles a day. I stopped less than 30 minutes in all this hike.

Believe me, I really wanted to eat and drink at a restaurant, stay at a hotel and take a shower, but I don’t think any would have admitted me at 3am. Plus with no cellphone service it’s hard to do things on the go. I did my share of spending in NH and NY with friends. This wasn’t a weekend for this, I was only planning to sleep stretches of 2 hours in the car. I’m still spending on gas, food and park permits and even promoting this awesome park.


Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:22 pm
Profile
Flatfoot
Flatfoot

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2016 3:19 am
Posts: 13
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
The glove problem is different for everyone. I can't wear big gloves because I have Raynaud syndrome so if my hands stop heating, it's very hard to get them back. So I wear thin gloves that allow fingers to exchange heat under big mittens. My mittens were not big enough that day.

In very cold days, my only way to keep them alive is to put them directly on my skin between my legs and I will hike this way for good stretches. I can't hold poles, but one ice axe is ok, since I can switch hands and heat the other. Anyways, I've learned to deal with this and my solution for the GPS is to use a GPS with buttons like the Garmin GPSMAP. I just bought one, but don't know how to use it. Plus I can use the Energizer L91 rated for -40C. The stylus is a good idea, but it adds complexity and uses two hands.

Fogging, I don't know yet. I've seen Simone Moro do G2 in winter and at some point they did have goggles, but another time in a blizzard they didn't wear them. So my solution for now is to not wear goggles and arrange something that will only leave a small hole for the eyes. I will experiment with goggles, I ordered some big ones with double lens, I don't think they would fog up in 60mph winds and I only felt uncomfortable in those conditions and wind in the face. Also fogging happens if you cover the nose and mouth and there's not enough wind. I'd like to avoid having to carry them. It's more weight and complexity.


Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:36 pm
Profile
Hiking Forums Are My Crack
User avatar

Joined: Sun Jun 29, 2008 9:39 am
Posts: 5664
Location: Not Mass 8)
 Re: Wildcat/Moriah Traverse + Presidential Traverse 2/6/2016
iagreewithjamie wrote:
rich99 wrote:
-wear bigger gloves and be able to use the GPS without removing them
-find a better facemask solution (I used two thin buffs and no goggles, because they fog up)


Thanks for these two points - these are things I find difficult.
First, any thoughts from anyone on solving the Dexterity vs Insulation dichotomy?
Second, are there any options for preventing fogging?

I use Julbo Glacier Glasses. They're usually fine, but once the sweat and heat kick in, they almost invariable fog up. Is there a wax or film you can put on your goggles/mask to prevent fogging?

Thanks.


Since I strated winter hiking this combo has proven exellant for my hands. I use THESE as a liner.

And these mittens on top of those EMS Summit

My hands do well in cold anyway but I can tolerate several minutes in extreme cold with just those liners when I need to use my fingers. GPS, phone, etc.

As for fogging goggles. The very first thing is you have to spend some doe on a good pair. A good pair will have dual vented lenses and an anti-fog coating on the inside lens. A common mistake made when using googles is putting them on, then maybe not needing them for a while and just just putting them up on their head. A lot of heat (steam) is coming off your head which heats up the goggle a bit. Now you put them back on your cold face. Forget the fog, you'll have frost you'll never get off for the rest of the hike.

_________________
Adventure is not a race. - Unknown


Tue Feb 09, 2016 4:40 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.   [ 28 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group.
Designed by Hike-NH.com based on STSoftware.